Riddle Me This Part Three

When is a serious safety hazard not a hazard?   Can we all say DYSFUNCTIONAL .....


Taken verbatim from Wednesday's BOS meeting;

Selectman Ruth would like to alert the Board to problems over at the tannery. Leroy is very concerned about liability issues. Selectman Ruth said, “There are holes where the old tanks were. Some depths of these tanks were about 12 feet. If someone falls in they won’t be able to get out. It isn’t fenced in any more. These are some pictures I took of where the leather factory was. These are different areas. These walls are approximately 12 feet high, and there is no way of getting out of it if you fall in. There are no ladders or access to the surface.” Selectman Sepe said, “If Leroy is concerned about it why isn’t he here speaking to us.” Gus said, ”These are my concerns.  Leroy is concerned about the buildings. Selectman Fraser asks  ”Did Leroy bring this to your attention?” Selectman Ruth said “No, somebody else had brought it to my attention because it was found that turtles are trapped in there now. Snapping turtles, Wood turtles, and Painted turtles are trapped inside these. Selectman Sepe clarified that this is not a secured property. Selectman Ruth said “First of all the turtles need to be removed before winter, or they will die in there. The water is about 2 feet deep. I think we should do something. Right now I have 2 people that are willing to help, one is a licensed trapper and the other is an individual from town who is willing to go down there and trap the turtles and take them out.  Right now we have 2 feet of water in there, and I would like to get the Fire Department or someone with a portable pump to pump the water out.” Chairman Tedford suggests demolishing one wall. Selectman Ruth said, ”The holding tanks are 12 feet below the surface, and they will fill up again.” The Board is concerned that the tanks are 12 feet deep, and if someone falls in there is no way of getting up and out of these. Selectman Ruth said “Right now the bottom of them is probably water level, in the spring and the fall it’s going to be above.” Selectman Fraser asks, ”Now at one point were they fenced off ? Or has it always been this way?” Selectman Ruth said, “There was a fence around the whole property. But, the fence has been torn down. They are pulling some fence off where the sewer plant is.  That whole fence maybe can be used over there until possible we sell it.  The other thing that should be done is the brush and the debris around the wholes should be cleared. Chairman Tedford proposes boring some holes in it and letting it drain. Selectman Ruth said, “The bottom of it is below the water table. Especially in the spring, winter and the fall. Chairman Tedford said” Take a piece of equipment and knock a wall out and let it run in the ground. All it’s got to be is rainwater. You said there is snapping turtles in there?” Selectman Ruth said,” I think you have to go out there and take a look at it.” Chairman Tedford asked how turtles got in there. Selectman Ruth said “ The brush has grown up around the edge of the tank foundations, the turtles have crawled up and over, fallen in and can’t get out. I’m more concerned about a kid falling in and can’t get out. Selectman Ruth explains the pictures he passed around. Selectman Ruth said” I seriously think we have a serious liability problem there. Selectman Tedford asks, “How long has that been like that? 30 years, 20 years 15 years now all of a sudden it is a hazard?” Chairman Ruth said, ”It’s always been a hazard.” Selectman Tedford asks ”Why haven’t the previous boards addresses these issues then?” Selectman Ruth said “You want to make it a hazard when somebody dies in there?” Selectman Fraser said, “ I’ve never been aware of it. So, what do you think we can do?” Selectman Ruth said, “First of all I’d like to get the turtles out and I think we should clear the brush away from the edge of it and put a fence up around them. There are 3 places like that down there. It would take 300-400 yards of material to fence it in. Selectman Tedford said “Before doing anything make sure that Brownfield and everyone else is thru with that property. There was a big 1000-gallon tank up there that somebody demolished years and took away. These tanks have been there ever since the tannery closed now all of a sudden it is a hazard? Why didn’t they address it years ago?” Selectman Ruth said, “ I think they should have.” Selectman Tedford said ”It seems funny now it’s all hazard today and it wasn’t 10 years ago, 8 years ago, 7 years ago. Selectman Ruth said, “ You can’t have an in ground swimming pool that deep and not put a fence around it. You are required by law to have a fence. Selectman Tedford said, “That property used to be fenced in.  So, we need to do more research on it, instead of talking about it all night.” Selectman Ruth said, “I would like something to happen very soon.” Selectman Tedford said “Maybe you could research it for the Board.” Selectman Ruth said, “I’ve done enough research on it, and it is a hazard.” Selectman Fraser said, “So we need to put the fence back up.” Selectman Ruth said “ I think we should fence around each individual unit, rather than fence the whole property like they have before.” Selectman Tedford said, ” I think they should bulldoze a hole in it and then it won’t be a hazard. Then the water can drain out of it and it won’t be a hazard. Selectman Ruth said, “I think you better go down there and take a look at it.  It won’t be that easy.” Selectman Tedford said, “I will go down there and take a look at it. I think it’s easy. I think if you bulldoze a hole in it and let the water drain out. That’s what I think. I’ll go down and look at it with you.” Selectman Ruth said “ Alright, and the other thing is that I would like to get the turtles out of there. And to do that we need to pump the water out and get 2 people in there to pick up the turtles and move them.” Selectman Fraser asks, “Who can pump it out? The Fire Department?” Selectman Ruth said, ” I think that they have a pump they can use without electricity.” Selectman Tedford said, “If they can pump it out, and once it is pumped out if we knock a hole in it. It won’t be a water hazard anymore, will it?” Selectman Ruth said, “When it rains, it fills up.” Selectman Tedford said, “I don’t agree with the idea.” Selectman Ruth said “ If I get a lot of resistance on this, then I think you are missing the point.” Selectman Tedford said, “I’m not missing the point. Those tanks have been like that for 5 or 6 previous boards, and you have done nothing about it.  And you never did anything about them then.” Selectman Ruth said ”I did bring it up once before and nothing got about it.”  Selectman Tedford said” I’ve been here with you for 4 years now and this is the first time you brought it up to me.” Selectman Ruth said ”Well I guess none of the other Board members are interested.” Selectman Fraser said, “ I would like to look at it, I agree something needs to be done. I would hate to not do anything. This is the first I’ve heard of it, and we need to get it pumped out.” Selectman Ruth said, “ The LGC came down and looked at the park, and they were concerned about a 7 ft. drop off. We are talking about a 12 ft. drop off over here.” Selectman Fraser asked, “Can we look at it this week? And address it next week?” Selectman Tedford said, “You go ahead and look at it. I have already looked at it, I’ve been up there a thousand times.” Selectman Ruth said, “I talked to John Gormalo, he has talked to Barry.  He said Barry is very busy, but there are other people on the Fire Department that can run a pump over and pump it out. One of the volunteers is here tonight. His name is Corwin Karlson he is an expert on turtles. I have another person in town who wants to volunteer to rescue turtles he is a licensed trapper his name is Art Whipple.” Selectman Fraser said” Now what will you do with the turtles?  Just put them back on the outside?” Selectman Ruth said “ We need someone to pump the water out of there, because there are snapping turtles in there. And right now there is duckweed growing and you can’t see below the surface. You don’t want to be reaching in there” Selectman Ruth said “I’d like to make a motion to have Barry or the Fire Department pump out the water so we can remove the animal life that is trapped in there.” Selectman Fraser said” I’ll second it for discussion to be sure it is something they can do.” Selectman Sepe said “I don’t want to lead volunteers onto property until Barry looks at it.” Selectman Tedford said, ”At one point treated water came out of those tanks. So, isn’t there a control valve that drains those tanks? Can’t that just be broken off and let it drain? Because those tanks used to released that water into the river.” Selectman Ruth said, “ They had pumps. The pumps were behind the manhole covers. There are probably lines that go into those wells.  That is where the pump access goes.  They don’t gravity drain. Selectman Tedford said, “ Before you call up Barry to pump it out, you should call up Rick Meleski and Dale.  They have a sludge pump up there.  Rick can tell you how to hook the waste pump onto the existing lines and drain the water that way.” Selectman Ruth said, “They are pretty rusted right now.” Selectman Tedford said, “Dig a hole with the backhoe and break a hole thru the wall, and let it drain.” Selectman Ruth said, ”I didn’t want to make a long project out of this.  I’m just trying to save these turtles.” Selectman Tedford said, “If you break a hole then the water would come out quicker, so the turtles would be exposed so you could take them out. Rick should know where the inlet or the outlet is; either way the water comes in from the bottom and goes thru that circulation drain.  So, you should be able to drain from the inlet or the outlet without getting inside.” Selectman Ruth said, ”A lot of that stuff is pretty old, and I don’t think those valves are going to work any more.” Selectman Tedford said, “They will if you hook a backhoe to them and break them off. You had a motion to have the Fire Department pump out the water, to be seconded after discussion. All those in favor say I.  All opposed? ”  The motion was opposed 4-1. Selectman Ruth said,” Shelly, I would like these minutes verbatim.”      




Who needs a circus to come to town, we already have enough clowns.